Mormon Church Apologizes to Family of Simon Wiesenthal for Baptizing His Deceased Parents - ICTMN.com

It is a common practice they take your name and make you a mormon.

Yeah, and they come to your house and force you to go to church at gunpoint. And they make you wear a white shirt and tie and ride a bicycle. And you have to eat funeral potatoes at every meal.

Come on, people. I mean really.

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints didn't baptize anyone. It was an individual who broke the Church's prohibiting proxy baptisms for non-family members. The individual and his wife have both had access to the geneological library revoked indefintely.

And a proxy baptism doesn't convert anyone. If you're interested in the doctrine of baptism by proxy, there was a rather extensive discussion of it here.

A Mormon apologist.

OK, so some Mormons do it and some don't.

It shouldn't be done at all, to anybody, by anybody. That is all anybody here is saying. Just don't do it.

And then, the Mormon Church apologizes for it. What does that mean, really?

I wonder just how pissed Mormon families would be if they found out I was going to Mormon cemeteries and baptizing Mormons as Hindu? I have some Hindu friends, maybe I should start to work on the concept. This could be interesting.

I wonder just how pissed Mormon families would be if they found out I was going to Mormon cemeteries and baptizing Mormons as Hindu?

Probably not at all. I know it wouldn't affect me in the slightest. A better understanding of proxy baptism would calm a lot of the concerns brought forth here.

Rigbee Dugane, Re: your comment at 2.4. That was interesting.

Probably not at all. I know it wouldn't affect me in the slightest.

I find that doubtful since us just talking about it here already has you on the defensive and in a snit.

And, your reference to Mormon propaganda aimed at non-Mormons is offense.

Just don't do it and put an end to this practice.

there is another story today about the Mormons doing it again

Can you provide a link? Not that I don't believe you, because I know that there are individuals who violate church policy (and I don't think we're the only church with that problem), I'd just like to read the article.

I find that doubtful since us just talking about it here already has you on the defensive and in a snit.

We're talking about proxy baptism, which neither puts me on the defensive, nor in a snit, so I'm not sure what you're talking about there.

And, your reference to Mormon propaganda aimed at non-Mormons is offense

Not sure what you're talking about there, either. Are you referring to the NV article I linked?

Out of curiosity, what do you know about proxy baptism?

Thanks, Kavika. If that's true, it's a violation of church policy and should never have happened.

Rest assured, though, that if the spirit of Anne Frank does not accept the baptism, it's as if it never happened. That still doesn't excuse the person who submitted her name, though.

Anne Frank???? Oh, ouch! Nothing like picking a fight!

Here's a link.

Here's a link.

"Soul stealing?" Nothing like trying to stir up your readership, eh?

It does show, however, that the author knows nothing about proxy baptism.

I could have picked a less inflammatory link, but this one sums up the attitude of gentiles more succinctly for you. You don't have to worry about me stirring up the readership. They're already plenty mad.

And don't ask a mormon for a definition of proxy baptism if you don't want the sales pitch. Here's the Wiki link.

I think mormons were the first to this fight. If they didn't practice proxy baptism, there wouldn't be any contention. The highlight from the Wikipedia article is that they don't feel one has access to the 'kingdom of god' until they are baptized. In their hubris, they actually think this is doing a favor to the deceased. Not stated is that they will engage in deceit to accomplish their ends rather than examine their premises.

The highlight from the Wikipedia article is that they don't feel one has access to the 'kingdom of god' until they are baptized.

Which is pretty much basic Christian doctrine.

I think mormons were the first to this fight.

Paul mentions it in the New Testament. Our church is a bit younger than that.

Well, OK, then. Go for it. Proxy baptize everybody. Hey guys, the Mormons say it's ok. Don't worry about it. Let them do whatever they want, freedom of religion and all that cool founding father's stuff. They are just trying to save your stinking soul as best they can. It is, indeed, for your own good.

*do I need a sarcasm tag here?*

Another take on baptism for the dead from Huff Post.

Dead people cannot accept or reject anyting in this context.

Spirits don't die and can accept and reject things as well as you or I. I'm willing to entertain your arguments to the contrary, of course.

Another take on baptism for the dead from Huff Post.

That was a great article. Thank you for sharing it.

skydog @ #4................"if they got their hands on Native American geneologies........" there is NO IF! They have always believed Native American Indians are one of the lost tribes of Israel, and as such, they HAVE done thousands of "Proxy Baptisms", if not more! Their files and geneology records would put the Government to shame, not kidding! My son was friends with a Mormon fellow and would go to church with him occasionally. One day he came home and specifically ASKED me if my Mother (his grandmother) had ever been baptized!? Also everyone else in our family! Very seriously, if you were to do some research on that subject alone, you would be shocked!

Good article Kavika my friend. LDS members do not mind their own business in any instance! Very scary as far as I'm concerned.

Nookomis ♥

The church also has teams at headquarters in Salt Lake City and that travel around the world to identify as many people as possible to baptize, whether or not they’re in the lineage of present-day Mormons. “The church is constantly going through parish records, wills, deeds and every other genealogical source so they can extract names and put these people through the temple process,” says Bushman.

The LDS says it does not know how many deceased have been baptized. Experts say the number is in the millions.

http://gestetnerupdates.com/2012/02/16/cnn-explains-how-and-why-do-mormons-baptize-the-dead/

From the looks of it they are trying to baptise the world.

i know a lot about mormons. i'm surrounded by them.

i have a lot of close friends that are mormon, but they all moved away.

to get away from the mormons.

:|

Agreed.

You know, I've always tried to respect others beliefs even if I don't understand or agree with them, but I am hearing things coming out about the Mormon faith that deeply disturb me.

Every faith has the extreme fringe the sane wish would go away and shouldn't reflect upon the faith itself,but I'm just not hearing a strong enough condemnation from the church hierarchy here.

Kavika - I hope you update this as it develops

..although we don't agree on this, I respect your opinion and beliefs

^^^ Hey Kavika,

Man I'm sure glad you didn't flip out on me. :) All I wanted to do share what I've discovered. I did this once, back at a coffee shop and got the Mexican mad at me.

I didn't mind at that time, because he said his name was Valsquez, and that he was denouncing his Mexican heritage, but identified himself as a Pueblo Indian. I told him that he's a Mexican if he's a Pueblo. He gave me a dirty look then scolded to himself, "Ain't no Mexican in a Redskins blood."

Which I thought was hilarious, so I asked him, "Sir, what language do you speak if you're a Pueblo?"

Richard Velasquez: Pueblo Indian.

Me: No sir, that's the name of your tribe. What language is the language that Pueblo's talk in?

Richard Velasquez: Native American! Whatever. (with a sheesh gesture).

Me: Wrong. It's Uto-Aztecan. Uto-aztecan translated into American english is Utah- Aztec. That's Aztec by way of the secondary branch of the Aztec empire under the ruling of Prince Uto.

Richard Velasquez: What? I've never heard of that!

Me: So, you've never bother to read into it, did you? You are more Mexican than any of us modern-day Latino Mexicans can say! Because the rest of blurred with the Europeans in our bloodline.

Richard Velasquez, closes his laptop, gets out of his chair: "Well, I've never heard of that. So I think you're wrong." (leaves the coffee shop).

Seeing as how he had his laptop and that anybody can wikileak the info, I was going to walk him through our history on his computer, while putting aside what I was doing and look up more stuff as he read through. Some of my family members found it entertaining, but that velasquez guy was the first I've ever seen flip out like that. So, again, I'm glad you kept your cool. I was actually a little hesitant to share my stuff, for a little bit. :)

On that same subject, do you have any info on where our ancient ancestors came from? Also, how many tribes in specific, or in general, because I'm still gazing into history's testamonies, docs, and sometimes theories to try to piece the puzzle. Particularly, by way of migration, but I will take whatever clues I can get. ;) <:) If it's cool with you.

k

Hey Kavika!

I hope that was your email that I responded to, and I can't wait to read the feedback. <:)